[Step 2.1] Check the displays we found!

#1

Dear Eve Family,

The next step in Eve’s monitor project is here! Based on your votes, from now on we will refer to this as Project: Spectrum!

Before jumping into the discussion I would like to tell more about the results we have seen so far and give you an overall project update.

The story so far

Based on the results from the previous rounds we can see that what makes a great monitor is partially down to preference, and partially down to bang for the buck. Some people prefer higher refresh rates, others want higher resolution. Neither specification is ultimately king when determining whether someone will enjoy using the monitor or not.

A new approach

This week we’re changing up our approach: instead of collecting opinions and trying to match a panel to them, we’re sharing a whole bunch of panels available on the market and ask your opinions of them!

We also think that though specs go a long way toward determining which screens are fit or unfit for our purpose, they don’t help much when the remaining panels have the same or similar specs. One key to success is to get our hands on samples so that we can find out which panel looks best in real life. That should help us get the complete picture. We will be receiving our first samples this Friday already, and will of course let you guys know about our findings.

So what will Eve Spectrum be?

Our vision

Our vision is to make the best monitor of 2019 that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg. We want to make sure that the monitor we make can be used for high-speed gaming as well as graphics work, with great colors for everyone. It should give you a “Wow!”-feeling the first time you look at it, and using it daily should be a pleasant experience.

  • :+1:That sounds about right
  • :-1: That doesn’t sound right

0 voters

Our users

The users we’re targeting, use their computer for a variety of purposes. They browse the web, watch movies, play games, and get serious with photo or video editing. They’ve seen amazing screens on their smartphones or their Eve V, and wonder why their desktop computer still has a mediocre, basic monitor. It’s hard to go back after being spoiled! Our users also want to have a monitor that offers all the useful technology the market has to offer today, and want it to stay relevant for the next few years. They are looking for great value, and want to get the best monitor they can get without breaking the bank.

  • :+1:That sounds about right
  • :-1: That doesn’t sound right

0 voters

Our limitations

What we’re not making, is a pure professional display. Graphics professionals that require every drop of color accuracy for their work, and require regular re-calibration fall outside the scope of what we want to offer in our monitor. Our competitors in that market are also better equipped to support the rigorous after-sales service model such pros require for their mission-critical gear.

  • :+1:That sounds about right
  • :-1: That doesn’t sound right

0 voters

What the market has to offer

With the V we learned that when it comes to the display it is mission critical to work with a supplier that is willing to work with us and support our crowd development model. The supplier also has to be big enough to ensure a steady supply of screens.

While you have been supplying us with valuable information on your preferences regarding the perfect monitor, we have been sourcing displays from panel vendors and looking for the right manufacturer for the project.

Finding a perfect panel is not an easy task. Sometimes you find a panel that has an amazing spec sheet but in reality the colors look dull or light leakage is way out of hand. On the other hand you might find a panel with what looks like an average spec, that turns out to be a winner once testing it side by side with others!

We have gone through a lot of panel spec sheets in the past few weeks and while we are waiting to receive actual samples to see which panels look best in person, we have a few panel specs we’d like to hear your thoughts on.

Introducing our contestants!

All of the panels on this list are based on IPS technology and offer a 178° viewing angle. Many of the available panels are not included because they did not match community specs, such as being too small or too large, or lacking in resolution or color gamut. The panels are grouped by size and resolution, and we’ve numbered them for easy reference.


The beast

Let’s start with a beast of a panel that we found :japanese_ogre:… Panel #11 comes from a top-tier :jp: vendor, offers very high resolution as well as high refresh rates and an amazing color gamut. HDR1000, 500 segments of local dimming, actual 10-bit color: this panel’s got it all! The use cases for this beast? Anything you throw at it, really. :slight_smile: Maybe gaming is a bit of a GPU killer at 8K, but you can always scale it back to Ultra- or Full-HD :smiley:

So why are we looking any further? We could just make a monitor using that best-of-all-worlds panel, right? Well, there’s the price… :sob: The display panels alone costs $ 3 000 US each, so the end user price for the complete monitor will be as much as beast as its specs. That lead me to ask the manufacturer who this panel is actually for. The reality is that they don’t even have a customer for it yet, and the price won’t go down until they can produce it in higher volumes. And even then it would still be super expensive.

In our opinion, despite this panel’s specs being mind blowing, it doesn’t provide good value for money as the price is greatly inflated from lack of demand in the market.

The beauty?

Panel #3 looks very interesting to us as. It comes from a top tier :kr: vendor, offers 27 inches of splendor with HDR, a wide color gamut, but also high refresh rates and support for adaptive sync. It’s not quite the beast that #11 is, but is available at a fraction of the price. We think it should offer an amazing experience at an amazing value. Of course we need to see it in real life when the samples arrive before we can make any real decisions.

Also noteworthy

Panel #5 is a UHD (~4K) variant of #3, from the same vendor but with a 60Hz refresh rate and slower response time. In return, it boasts a higher contrast and 100% Adobe RGB coverage. The price is higher but not much so, so we’re looking forward to test these two samples in real life and see the difference ourselves.

You may also have noticed panel #1 with a 240Hz refresh rate. While being by far the fastest panel on the list, it is only Full HD. Its high speed and top-tier :jp: heritage make it similarly priced to #3, even though that panel outperforms it on every other metric. As the benefit of 240Hz over 165Hz is significantly less noticeable than the jump from, say, 60Hz to 165Hz, we don’t really think it’s worth pursuing. But feel free to try and change our mind if you feel otherwise!

Then we have a few 32" panels they primary from :cn: vendors and while specs look good (offering features like HDR600 at a much lower price point) we need to see those samples ourselves to make sure the panels live up to their promise!

Discussion time

What are your thoughts on the panels above? Which one of them do you think looks most exciting?

How do you like this post? What would you improve?

12 Likes
[Step 2] Talking about trade-offs
[Step 3] Let's talk about the stand!
#3

I’m unsure in what price range I should look. $$$$$$ only mean something in context, and I’ve seen screen range from $100 to $6000. And what $$$ is for me might not be $$$ for someone else. For me $$$ seems like about 300-500 range, $$$$ is about 500-750 range. Is this about right?

Any wayI’ll prefer 3 - 7 - 6, in that order. Though, again, I’m not sure what those dollar signs mean. 7 seems to be very expensive, but how much is that. I know I’m willing to pay more then most people here to satisfy my needs, because of that I also have higher standards.

Anyway, I’d like context, if that’s possible/legal.

(Are we limited to one screen or are you entertaining the option of offering multiple pricepoints?)

4 Likes
#4

#9 seems to be the one for me. I would eliminate 27" 4ks as it makes user interface elements too small.

2 Likes
#5

Definitely, absolutely no question #3 for me. I’m firmly in the camp that anyone who votes 60hz MUST GO SEE A 144HZ MONITOR before casting their vote. Go and use one for 30 seconds at a computer shop, then make your vote. It’s fine if you still prefer 60hz, of course, but I’d bet real money a vast majority would prefer 144hz over 4k.

I’m not saying 144HZ ALL DA TINGS no matter your actual preference, just please: try to make an informed vote in this metric. It’s very unappreciated, because it is poorly understood.

As for 27" 4K, I believe 200% scaling in Windows 10 should take care of that fairly easily. You’d effectively have a QHD monitor at 100% scaling but with 4K sharpness. However, I think that’s way overkill resolution for a 27" display. I have a 32" QHD panel and I don’t really miss lower resolution (and I’m only 2ft from the display).

5 Likes
#6

The one that are compelling for me are 3, 7, and 5 but if the difference in price is greater between 7 and the other two, then I think 3 and 5 are better, 5 seems to be the best but refresh rate must be 120 Hz, if that is possible if even cost increases little bit but not nearer to 7, then it will make it the best panel.

And, feeling so happy that Spectrum got chosen as the Project Name.

2 Likes
#7

Well think of it this way. Most expensive panel on the list is 3000 USD. Now this is just a reference pricing as we dont know the end product price yet as it will depend on few other things we will decide with you soon. But basically if one panel is $$ and the other is $$$$ it means that the display is twice the price and if its $$$$$$$$ it is 4 times the price of $$. So they are not random symbols :slight_smile:

Q: (Are we limited to one screen or are you entertaining the option of offering multiple pricepoints?)
A: :sunglasses:

2 Likes
#8

Overall I think that best option will be Panel 3, if going for two models differentiated by size then other Panel will be 7.

Each $ sign is equivalent to 50 USD, going by reference that panel 11 cost is $3000.

4 Likes
#9

Unfortunately I can only say “Thanks for trying”.
HDR400 and 8 block local dimming is a waste of money (just check the TFTCentral on HDR).

Panel 5 is the only decent one, ignoring/disabling the HDR, as far as my preferences are concerned but too small.

I already have a 4K 120hz 27inch with HDR400 (Acer XV273K) and I keep the HDR disabled cause is simply useless with the content available around. If you want to to watch a movie, just buy a good TV with at least 384 zones, not 8. If you want to play a game with HDR (those are extremely few) you need at least HDR600 with decent dimming otherwise it will just blow your eyes with light while losing a lot of contrast.

It blows my mind that a 32" 4K 120hz panel with DCI-P3 > 90% is still not available on the market but they spend resources creating an 8K 120hz that no GPU on the planet can drive.

Again, thanks for trying, maybe in a few years I’ll finally find the monitor I need :slight_smile:

3 Likes
#10

Just looking again; none of the 4K options have HDR, save for the most expensive panels by far. Two 32" panels have it, but are double the price of most other panels.

#3, The QHD panel not only has HDR; but local dimming, 165hz, AND 100% DCI-P3 coverage.

Two options would be interesting…personally, I’d vote for #3 as our mainstream model. For upper end, I’m torn between WQHD and UHD. #7 sounds absolutely beautiful and great for work/gaming, but #10 is good plain ol’ 4K with good HDR and awesome local dimming.

2 Likes
#11

I think that model #3 is actually the best option here - it’s among the cheapest ( 4 / 11 of maximum with the cheapest going down to 2.5)

QHD is good, 350 nits is really nice.
But what gives it the edge is HDR400 and 165 Hz.

The only question I’d have @Konstantinos is if we can go with a nice scaler that supports the full 165 Hz and can support FreeSync & be G-Sync certified (thus working with Nvidia GPUs)

5 Likes
#12

A little negative, perhaps? My friend has one of those “HDR” $500 QHD 144hz Samsung monitors that isn’t even HDR400. It may have a lack of contrast, but it DEFINITELY looks more true to life than with it off. I’ve toggled the HDR on and off through some live video and the difference is astonishing. Blew me and friends away.

If we want the best HDR, we’re going to be paying an arm and a leg.

#13

@Walkop some panels in the list might support HDR in the end of the day but it was not specified in the spec sheet.

@Nevril

Panel #7 is the closest currently to that. As for the HDR it doesn’t necessarily spike the price up in case of panel 3 it just comes as a result of DCIP coverage and capacity to have 400 nit brightness. 8 block local diming is optional for this panel so we could remove it and save cost. Its really a lot about samples. We will actually try to specifically inquire 144Hz 4k panels from fre vendors. We have checked but let us look once more!

@iKirin so far our understanding is that all of these panels support gsynch/freesynch as it’s mainly about the scalar.

3 Likes
#14

A note for @iKirin, Gsync doesn’t need certification anymore. Nvidia GPUs will work with Freesync monitors.

I think we’re better off looking for a good scaler that supports Adaptive Sync with LFS (Low Framerate Compensation). We want quality adaptive sync. Certification is a bonus IMO. Personally, I’d love the best quality adaptive sync we can get—but that really is a gamer specific feature. I’m good with Adaptive+LFS, anything else may not benefit the majority of users even though I’d personally love it.

1 Like
#15

I think you are suggesting Panel 10, it is great but it is sacrificing refresh rate, hoping that it had a higher refresh rate which would have made it the one of the top option for consideration.

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#16

Well, G-Sync is a bit more, if we don’t take the G-Sync Module from Nvidia.

@Walkop Well, it doesn’t need it but having it works without the User having to configure anything :wink:

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#18

Panel 3 and 7 are the most intriguing to me.

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#19

I think panel 3 is the best balance of all of these monitors, but I think we’re going to need to have some other features to distinguish our monitor from all the other 1440p monitors on the market. In the last thread some people were talking about giving the monitor pen support and a tilting base ie. surface studio… does anyone know how suitable each of the different panels are for that?

3 Likes
#20

So far none of these look interesting enough to me.

Somehow I’m convinced that among the panels that should see the light of the day this year, there must be one better suited than these.

Something closer to 32" 4K 16/9 Flat HDR 600-1000 Local dimming 300+ zones 120Hz.

How about these two for example, is it possible to know more about them, or that you guys get your hands on samples:

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3 Likes
#21

Definitely 3/7 from the specs so far. Love the 27" formfactor but 600 nits brightness are also really good. A bit sad you couldnt find a oled #3 version tho :smiley:

1 Like
#22

These also look great on paper, will be great if can be looked into for consideration.

1 Like