One liner update [01.09]

official
update

#183

Hmm, why did you left out the 2 things the article points out the largest gaps of the panel? The uneven backlight and the bleeding?
I for myself am happy with that it just partially uses PWM and with over a 1000 Hz freq. should not be noticeable, but i wonder now if how the backlight is driven is a feature implemented in the panel or outside - in other words what will be PWM in the V?


#184

The human eyesight is quite capable of extreme chromatic adaptions if you wait long enough (and don´t change the filter continously).
Just put on glasses with a blue light filter…or “gaming eyewear” cough :joy:

But i don´t think the human processing of color constancy belongs in this update thread :smile:


#185

sorry, in this waiting period one gets easy off focus :hushed:


#186

I don’t know if the backlight bleed was mentioned in the original article, I was going by @dibadibadu’s machine translated post. Note that backlight bleed is generally caused by uneven distance and/or pressure across the panel, which may not be an issue with our zero-gap bonding process. As for uneven backlight, that may be aided by the same process, and some of it by the calibration process.

I’m not saying that these aren’t issues, and I did not leave them out of my summary intentionally. It’s what happens when I quickly read and participate in the community in between tasks at work.

I’m also not trying to say that the reviewers are wrong in their testing methodologies or that their test results are not relevant. I was merely surprised by how the review (or the except from it machine translated by Dietmar, which is all I went by) seems to paint --to me at least-- a mostly positive image of the display, though the response to it seems mostly negative…


#187

Will we get any update on any progress within this week?
Can’t wait to get the V


#188

As you mentioned, we can´t imply that the EVE V will have the same backlight issues as the DELL. I even would go as far and suppose you will have an eye on it.

As a native German speaker i can assure you that the opinion about the DELL screen in the review is rather good. Everything is way above average…except the backlight problems and the consequences resulting from it. If backlight bleeding etc. will not be an issue i don´t see why the display could not be great. Maybe some people got over hyped and did expect the bleeding edge performance you find in 800€+ graphic Monitors.

TLDR: We really can´t judge the display until it is reviewed in an actual EVE V


#189

Exactly! Also remember surface and other products might also have issues such as light bleed. So it’s not really a matter of display itself but quality requirements.


#190

I agree. Perhaps the expectations were too high, also because the screen was repeatedly mentioned to have specifications “from the year 2020”. Now ot turns out (admittedly in another manufacturers implementation) it barely covers sRGB and suffers from many currently wide spread screen-related issues such as uneaven backlighting, potential pwm flicker etc. I sincerely hope screens in a couple of years will have support for far greater colorspaces as well as high brightness levels and contrast in order to be able to support HDR. Perhaps the “year 2020” reference was in in regard to power efficiency?


#191

“ok community! who wants to gossip and make a bias review about the V😃.” konstantinos OCT 2017
mental breakdown


#192

Then again, this is something that most notebook screens don’t fully cover - in the reviews I’ve peeked at quickly most screens were at ~90% accuracy (which is already pretty decent). And those were the higher end notebooks in the 1500€ category, cheaper ones were around 60% coverage as far as I saw.
Heck, according to notebookcheck the really nice screen in the SP Pro 2017 doesn’t fully cover sRGB: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Microsoft-Surface-Pro-2017-i7-512-GB-16-GB-Convertible-Review.236968.0.html

And regarding the PWM-flicker it was mentioned that it was at a pretty high frequency of 1000 Hz - and vanishes after putting the brightness at a decent level of ~180 nits. :slight_smile:


#193

100% srgb coverage was a selling point of the eve as far as I remember :slight_smile:

Tbh though 99.9% isn’t barely in my estimations :slight_smile:


#194

Out screen covers 100% sRGB. ±1 percent is within industry tolerance levels. I mean most equipment created to measure sRGB has a tolerance of 1-2 percent.

And after all we don’t know what implementation dell is using.

The only thing I know is that our new screen covers wider color gamut than Surface Pro.

Notebook check will get one unit soon and I am sure they will provide an unbiased review!


#195

As best I can find, the “year 2020” was just something one of the community members said while praising the screen quality. I don’t know why the reference got repeated so much. That statement makes no sense for technology. The screen has tech from 2016, otherwise we would not be able to have it in devices for 2017. If it was from the year 2020, it would not exist. Expectations are that in 2020, tablets will start to have 8K screens.


#196

I think this is the post were the “year 2020” thing started:


#197

Notebook check will get one unit soon and I am sure they will provide an unbiased review!

Funny you should say that, because here it is:

And what do they say [slightly corrected google translate]…

The 3K display from Sharp offers a resolution of 2,880 x 1,920 pixels, which corresponds to a pixel density of 281 ppi for a visible area of ​​12.3 inches. The touch display is equipped with Corning Gorilla Glass 4, which guarantees a very high scratch resistance. In order to counteract the reflections on the smooth glass surface, the display of the Dell Latitude 7285 is provided with a reflection-free coating. In addition, the anti-lubrication coating ensures that residues are easier to remove from the surface.

Within the scope of our measurements, the Sharp Panel achieved an average brightness of very good 490 cd / m². Here only the Dell Latitude 12 5285 with 522 cd / m² can keep up. The Dell Latitude 7285 loses with a brightness distribution at only 86% [same comment as other review]. This is where the Lenovo ThinkPad X1 yoga leads with 95%. For brightness control, the Dell Latitude 7285 uses PWM, which we measured with a display brightness of 20% with 922 Hz. Also at the edges shows with a completely black representation some “Clouding”, which is however not overly strongly pronounced. [see picture]

The display quality is very high. Color representations are very well reproduced and do not look washed out. In the delivery state, the average DeltaE-2000 deviations of the grayscale and the colors compared to the sRGB color space are only slightly increased (3.5 and 4.7, respectively). A calibration of the display could significantly improve these values ​​(1.0 or 1.2). The Farbräume can be covered to a large extent. With sRGB color space the Dell Latitude 7285 almost reaches 100% with a color space of 99.8%. The extended AdobeRGB color space is at 67%. In the test comparison, only the Lenovo ThinkPad X1 yoga, with its OLED panel, has a higher color space pecentage. Thus, the Dell Latitude 7285 can also be considered for (semi-) professional use.

Despite the antireflective layer, the glass surface can not avoid all reflections. But at least they can be minimized. For outdoor use, the Dell Latitude 7285 is nevertheless suitable, because the high display brightness can ensure even in the sunshine for good readability on the screen. However, since reflections can not be completely avoided, we still recommend users to prefer a shadow place.

At our angle of view, the screen behaves IPS-typical. All representations can be recognized very well from all nine viewing angles. Even with the four corner images, there are hardly any weaknesses which, despite IPS, are often covered with a light gray cloth.

So, all very positive, brighter than the spec, with the only slight downsides being the brightness distribution and some clouding (backlight bleed) around the edges (shown in the link), which might just be a manufacturing defect with that unit. One on the positive points listed for the laptop is the “very good 3K touch display with high color space coverage”.


#198

Fair enough. I can imagine the review focused on professional applications because it is a Latitude = business grade device, an so the uneven back-light etc. were ranked higher as issues.
I too rather tend to see the display positively, it is not an IPS panel so i would not expect great viewing angles from it anyway and for my use cases color accuracy etc is not of that large importance (and IMHO i would not think that a pro photographer would go for an Y CPU device from a startup with unknown support plans, so i dont think the V needs a ‘pro’ level display).
What extremely bothers me is the bleeding as i see it everywhere nowadays and cant understand why it is accepted by consumers that much when for example 20 years ago Trinitron CRTs were hated for 2 invisible lines…
All in all i hope the backlight issues will be addressed by QC as @Konstantinos mentioned, and/or by the bonding.
What about the PWM, if it is implemented are reasonable freqs used?


#199

I think (hope) he meant the EVE V and not the Dell :wink:


#200

Hi guys, would it be interesting to have the option to a faster shipping for limited birds as the 1TB option goes live, as we all have waited for so long.

In my case, I’m from Chile and asked EVE to delivered my V to Los Angeles, CA where my girlfriend lives. I went to the states in March hoping to get the V by then, my gf came in June and nothing happened, now heading back again to LA next week till the end of October, so I’m guessing that I won’t get the V neither before I fly back home, so I will have to wait till December/January as I might head back to the US by then.

Customs are ridiculous in Chile and shipping thieves often too so I prefer not to deliver it here.

I would love to have the option to get it faster instead of a 1TB upgrade and be in the line of those upgrades before getting mine. Just saying.

Shipping UPGRADE? :slight_smile: would be soooo nice…
@Konstantinos @iKirin


#201

The SSD upgrade wont slow any shipments down, so there is no possibility to upgrade to a faster shipping. And that also would be unfair for other Hyper Early Birds


#202

Because almost all IPS display behaves like this so its more on the matter of “we got no alternative anyway”, while no other CRT had the 2 invisible lines back in the day.