How about a developer/pro laptop from Eve?


#1

With Macbook going down the drain and other developer laptops too pricey and not powerful enough, their is a big void in the market that Eve could fill.

What do developers/pro users want?

  • Powerful CPU
  • At least 16GB ram, option for 32 and 64
  • HiDPI screen
  • Option for discreet graphics
  • Open platform that runs Windows and Linux perfectly
  • Decent battery life
  • Up-gradable
  • Affordable
  • 14" and 15" screen options

Nice to have things:

  • Form factor like aluminum allow uni-body
  • Lightweight
  • Great battery life

Right now 2 laptops on the market come quite close. First one is the Lemur from System76 (https://system76.com/laptops/lemur) and second is Razor Blade Stealth (http://www.razerzone.com/store/razer-blade-stealth).

Are you a developer, graphics designer or someone who needs a pro portable machine?

What would you like in a pro laptop?


The V blew me away but whats next?
A 2 in 1 laptop/tablet with some performance?
Please create a real pro device
A 2 in 1 laptop/tablet with some performance?
#2

Hi @Owais_Lone!

I agree with you that the Macbook was pretty crap for a “Pro” machine (as I’m an IT student when not working for Eve) and I agree with you on many points regarding what we as devs want in a dev-machine.

You should definitely check out *[this thread] (Make a compelling laptop for serious work and some play) by @psihius where people already voiced their opinion that they want to see a notebook by Eve that can be used for work and gaming.

And while I don’t fully agree with some points (64GB RAM e.g. is not feasible and I think not even supported by the mobile CPUs) I agree on many other points! :slight_smile:


#3

I’m writing this as a consumer. 64GB may or may not be feasible without making the laptop big enough from engineering perspective. I’m just writing what I as a consumer am looking for. I believe that’s what we should do and leave the implementation to the engineers. If it can’t be done, it can’t be done :slight_smile:


#4

It’s unfortunately litereally impossible, as Intels mobile CPUs don’t allow anything more than 32GB of RAM - and at least in my eyes that should be more than enough for even hardcore development :slight_smile:


#5

HQ processors (at least some of them) do allow 64GB:

@Owais_Lone I’m totally with you here :slight_smile: but I would like to add more emphasis on making the laptop a little bit different.
Nowadays, they all try to make laptops thin, light, etc. - but IMO that’s not the point when we’re talking about a workhorse. Being powerful must be the number one focus. And to keep that for a longer time, it has to be upgradable.
You said it would be nice to have a “unibody”, “lightweight” design. I beg to differ, and I offer a different approach: make it as thick as needed, and as ugly as needed, because the main goal is to make it powerful. And the power should never be sacrificed.
However, since it’s a laptop (not a desktop), it must have decent battery life. To add more battery, either thickness or power must be compromised. But then again, I would like the power to remain as high as possible. No sacrifice here. Just make it weigh 3kg, be 4cm thick… I don’t care, as long as that helps keeping it more powerful.
And finally, my biggest disappointment with today’s laptops: the input devices. Keyboards are shallow, touchpads are shitty, they’re big but they’re missing proper buttons. I would like to see another laptop with similar keyboard/touchpad to the good old IBM Thinkpads. A numpad is a must. F1-12 are a must. Home/end/page up/down are a must. Full-size arrow keys are a must. Real mouse buttons are a must. Long key travel is a must. And the keyboard must have some tactile feedback. Unlike those pesky laptop keyboards nowadays…


THAT is the perfect keyboard.

I don’t care that it’s THIS thick.

It’s meant to be thick. Because it has “thick” power.

What do you think? Do you agree with what I said? Or am I the only one who doesn’t like the recent changes in design?

P.S. there is really not much difference between 14" and 15", so I think we should either choose just one size to sell, or make it more drastic, like 13/15" or 15/17".


#6

I could like that kb and stuff. Only the trackpad is too small.


#7

That’s what I was preaching in my topic.
Everyone gone for the the thinnest, the shiniest and the most expensive laptop out there.

But we need out Thinkpads back. Good CPU power, good GPU power, decent battery life (put the GPU into power saving mode, put CPU into deep power saving mode, park the cores - whatever you need to do so it woks decent time on battery by default - leave us the option to enable full power to CPU at least, GPU maybe too much for battery - I don’t care! I want it going full throttle when it’s plugged in).
Removal of optical drives and HDD’s will make a lot of free space in case like linked in a photo above. You probably will get enough additional space to shrink it a little thickness wise, displays these days are much thinner too.

I just yesterday poked at my local web shop to see how much a laptop for my use case will cost me - one model at 2,300, 3 - 2,500-2,600-is, other way past 3k EUR. Give me a break…


#8

The trackpad could be a bit bigger. But only as long as it doesn’t sacrifice the keyboard. I know the problem with small trackpads, especially old ones… If the mouse sensitivity is too low, ypu have to keep lifting your finger off it very frequently, which is tiring. To avoid it, you need to set the sensitivity really high, but then those old trackpads don’t have enough precision.
However, making it bigger is not the only solution. You can also make it more precise. I mean even desktop mice are limited. They don’t work on all surfaces, sometimes you need a mouse pad. But have you ever felt the problem that your mouse pad is too small? I haven’t. Not that I use mouse pads often. But even when I do, there is always a very simple solution that solves all the problems: click my mouse’s DPI button. I can work within a square that is barely bigger than the mouse itself - say, 2cm larger to every direction - pretty easily, without lifting the mouse often, until I reach the barrier of my hand’s dexterity. But that barrier is far away. I could easily work on a trackpad as small as 4x6cm, as long as it’s precise enough.


#9

In the picture there are is easily as much space over the kb as being taken up by the trackpad. With similar dimensions one could get up to twice the height, and it would easy to make it wider as well.
And I know the space above is probably speakers, but I personally don’t see the point of having them that big. Or there at all, if the thing is supposed to be a workhorse.
Regarding precision, trackpads have come a long may since their dawn.


#10

Yes, that’s what I wanted to say: let’s not worry about size that much, becausw nowadays the precision is so good you don’t need all that area.

And yes, I still think this trackpad is a bit too small. Moving the keyboard upwards would be a good decision as that would leave more area for the trackpad while not sacrificing the keyboard, which is very important.

But most importantly, I love how that keyboard feels. The keys are deep, they have at least some feedback when pressing, some resistance… Maybe not as good as a desktop keyboard, but definitely much batter than what I’ve seen on any other laptop.


#11

I agree that size and weight should not be more important than performance in a pro latop but at the same time it is quite important. Previous gen Macbook Pros are decent size and with today’s tech can pack a lot of power. I’d even be willing to buy a somewhat thicker laptop if that meant more memory and power backup but I believe it is technologically possible at the moment to create a decent sized laptop with all that power. For example, I’d buy the Lemur from system76 if it had HiDPI screen (1080 is a pain to use after using Retina for 3 years) and if it has a bigger touchpad.


#12

I particularly like the upgradable option.
Future proofing is really important as you can then have a higher initial spend that amortises nicely over longer ownership period.
I would assume this could well keep the machine relevant for five years and outlive its last three years as a home or school machine before being recycled or exported to a developmental project.


#13

Umm, so are you looking for a powerful laptop or not? Lemur has a 15W CPU. No wonder it’s thin…
And the trackpad is already plenty large, you can increase the mouse sensitivity to make it better :stuck_out_tongue:


#14

I would like to see NO number pad. I have been searching for an alternate 15" laptop since Apple have dropped the ball, and every decent 15" laptop has a damn number pad, which offsets the keyboard to the left, rendering it horrible to use on you lap (or at all). I would basically like a 15" macbook pro copy, but without the current infatuation for thinness over usefulness. Something as beautiful as a macbook pro, but with functionality ahead of thinness. It doesn’t have to be 3cm thick, but doesn’t have to be 3mm thin either.


#15

Well, we can only agree to disagree here :slight_smile: To me, a numpad is a must, and I don’t really care where the keyboard is… It can be completely off from the screen, I wouldn’t mind it because I don’t look at the keyboard anyway :stuck_out_tongue:
And I don’t care what it looks like. If you want a “beautiful” laptop, then why not just buy a photo of a laptop and hang it on your wall :slight_smile: I want a functional and powerful laptop :slight_smile:


#16

a 15" laptop without numpad seems a design failure to me. Certainly if it is one for performance or gaming. For lap-ability there are 12-13" laptops without numpad since they lack the space.


#17

I think you’re thinking of the Razer Blade 14. The Razer Blade Stealth is an ultrabook, and is not a particularly powerful machine (though good for its small size).

If I’d have to pick one feature from Apple that should be carried over to all other manufacturers, it’s their excellent trackpads. They’ve been doing accurate and reliable glass multitouch trackpads for over ten years now, and PC manufacturers are oftentimes still mucking about. It’s why almost every PC customer I deal with pulls out a mouse as soon as they take their laptop out of their bag, and Mac customers barely ever do…

If there is room for a numpad, there should be a numpad. And at 15", there is room for a numpad.

As for upgradability, I think people need to get used to the idea that it’s not as awesome as it sounds. The only reason RAM upgrades were so awesome in the past, is because manufacturers severely skimped out on adding it in the first place. Since the cost at production of adding more memory is generally smaller for the end user than buying an upgrade later, just make sure there’s enough in there to begin with. It’s a high-end machine. Make 16GB the baseline. User-replacable memory modules add unneccesary build complexity, size, weight, energy usage en potential points of failure.

Now, a free M.2 slot would be something to consider as an upgradability option. Maybe even instead of a 2.5" bay. 1TB SSDs are becoming more affordable, and even a super-budget cheap-y-cheap SATA AHCI SSD would be significantly faster than a high-end 2.5" mechanical hard drive. And use less power. And weigh less. And be less prone to wear and damage through movement…


#18

Well, I have never been a fan of trackpads. But I have to admit that I did never use a macbook. For gaming and production I use a mouse which does everything I want (and no it is not a gaming mouse, just a 15€ bluetooth mouse). But I have a second hand surface pro 3 now and that has a multitouch trackpad, and I never need a mouse with it. Largely because of the touchscreen and pen that I even had use when trying some video editing, and I prefer that over using the touchpad. But there are certain things I use the touchpad for: scrolling when I am typing or such and for switching between programs. Now I feel that I lack those 2 functionalities on my asus low end gaming laptop.


#19

Me, I’d deem user replacability very important, not so much for upgrades as much more for repairs… and it’s not just about RAM, but also about HDD/SSD, any other M.2 cards… hell, in my current laptop it’s even possible to replace the CPU :angel:

In terms of size and weight I feel that it wouldn’t be noticeable considering we’re talking about some kind of mobile workstation that won’t be super-flat and extra-light anyways :wink:

Just my personal two cents, probably influenced by the long lifecycle I expect and my unwillingness to wait for repairs to be done by someone else :smile:

CRUs rule!!! :sweat_smile:


#20

What is your current laptop? I suppose it’s quite old, as Intel has stopped making laptop socketed CPUs some time ago… Such a shame!