Hire a proper PM with an industry recognised qualification


#21

There is only one Tag @ Team in this post and that was the OP, the rest wrote it in lower case so it doesn’t trigger the system.


#22

Ah, didn’t realise on my phone. My bad!


#23

It still triggers it. It just doesn’t look like it. At least as far as I know. Can @nawthor @iKirin @Helios please confirm this? If @ team does the same as @ Team without people knowing, this might be a big part of the issue with the multitude of tags.


#24

4 posts were merged into an existing topic: The battery in the V


#26

I found when making reference to the Team, it is better done by not including the @ in front of their name.
Then they will not get a bunch of unnecessary notices.

They can also be named by putting a space between the @ and their name.
That way no notice will be sent.
However the “space” method could lead to a keyboard slip and a notice will be sent.

I prefer to eliminate the @ from the name altogether.
That way we all know what each other means.

Use the @ only if you want that person to be notified of your comments.

BTW The team does not have time to read every members personal comments or concerns and of course so many will become spam to them.


#27

I am a LB backer. I’m not trying to be negative and I know the risk I took when I backed. But when is enough enough? When do the constant delays mean more than growing pains? I don’t know of a single tech product that can be a year late and be acceptable to the purchaser. Save for the wait it’s becoming obsolete by the day. Others are catching up to what was once bleeding edge. I guess more of a question to accountability on the part if the EVE team. Was the V a success? Yea its “made” but is that enough? I almost am going to be disappointed to get mine because of all the broken promises and " it’s out of our control" excuses. This is through the lens of a consumer not an enthusiast. It’s just like " yay we made a computer!" But now " shit how do we MAKE a computer." To be brutally honest Eve is NOT as open as they claim to WANT to be. Weekly updates with pictures and explanations of the process is what I was expecting. Instead I got speculation from the team in response to a missed goal or deadline. Thats not transparency that PR. I don’t care how busy you are someone can type a paragraph and explain where exactly you in the process even if nothing is new. Man I hate to say it but just the way it all has been handled has the optics of lack of planning, logistical knowledge and general inexperience in project management. This was half venting and half question to the community on what did you REALLY accomplish? Were the goals met? Was it open enough in the process? Did the timeline ruin the project? Just think beyond “it’s made!” And analyze the project as a whole. I don’t know myself. Which if I have to even think about these things then for me it might be a success failure. I just don’t know.


#28

We are holding then to the standards the people who made the thing set forth!


#29

Lol I thought it is community managers’ responsibility to filter out related and useful materials, and request the core members to answer.
When they r busy that cannot ‘go through them all and find the relevant one, it is your duty.

Or I misjudged your roles


#30

We are notified regardless of whether the T in team is upper or lower case. The only difference is that the lowercase one doesn’t link to the group.


#31

You know what, I’m fed up with this “it’s your own fault” bullshit being dripped all over by some members. Tell you what, I will come over and wreck your car, and then say “but it’s your fault, you had to consider the risks when buying a car”. It doesn’t work that way. You can’t just wipe all the responsibility off Eve’s shoulders. They are responsible for the delays and it’s about time they get their shit together, because they promised more than this.


#32

Your argument has no parallel to what is happening. Destruction of property that has been paid for is one thing, investing in a start up company is another thing. I do understand the frustration of backers but realistically its foolish to be 100% confident in a small company making their first device to uphold every single promise they’ve made. Frankly, these delays have resulted in a better and more polished final product.


#33

Destruction is not the point here. The point is your “your fault, should have assessed the risk” attitude. And no, it’s foolish to give promises you can’t keep.

Yes, it’s partially our fault for believing Eve, but that just shows how bad they are. They can’t be trusted. They don’t keep promises.


#34

I think they still have time to redeem themselves with the flash sale orders. Delays for the very first batch of people buying the device are unavoidable since they didn’t yet have all the details figured out. Now that they’ve established manufacturing they should be able to keep their time frames in check.


#35

A few weeks, a month… yeah, that’s unavoidable. But WAKE UP. It has been OVER HALF A YEAR. And even when they said they figured everything out, they still had like 5 extra delays after that.


#36

I think this can be associated with “how to communicate”. You probably know the saying ‘If you don’t have anything nice to say, don’t say anything at all.’ Besides that, if you’re the leader of something (like the Eve team is in essence) you don’t badmouth your own project. If they don’t show support, why should anyone else? It’s a tricky scenario. I’ve encountered it in some (internet) communities I was part of, or a ‘leader’ in some cases, starting 10 years ago. It can go right, but can also go horribly wrong. It’s usually better to do the save thing and keep being optimistic. And yet, I smile ~ walking dead

Anyhow, I’m not a backer so my financial risks in the V are 0, since I joined the community just recently I also don’t know the specifics of the delays etc. So my question to everyone who has replied here is very simple.

Let’s assume the delays are fixed. These would’ve happen no matter the team involved. I’m not arguing they could’ve been avoided but for the sake of argument, let’s assume they couldn’t be avoided.
“If the team did a better job in communicating the reason and type of delay. And if the team admitted they made some mistakes during the process. Would that have eased your mind about the said issue?”

That being said, I do have experience with being a backer and receiving the product 2 years later, or more. It’s frustrating, yes. Especially with something that is replaced by a faster version (like the CPU) in the process. I’m not saying it should happen. I’m saying it does happen quite often.

@Joe_Nixon there is one issue i’d like to raise against your arguments. That is they pay of a PM that has the required skillset, experience, etc. Are we sure Eve can afford that? Or do the prices of the products need to go up?


#37

Well this all seems like a nice end of year review from my highschool engineering and economics courses. I don’t remember so many F-words in those classes though.

Aside from the usual fallacies and whining that accompanies all internet rants, the OP actually does make some good points about goal setting and procedures. A lot of expectations that were publicly stated by Eve could have avoided retraction if they had verified the requirements before sending out good news. Eve sacrificed some of their reputation for transparency by backtracking on these statements and schedules.

As for the rest of the OP, the only thing that really irks me enough to ask is this: Why do you want to know the Amp-hours rating of the battery? Contrary to the belief popularized by battery manufacturers, that doesn’t tell you how much energy it can store. The only way it is useful is if you also know the nominal voltage and use that to calculate Watt-hours (which if I recall the V has 48Wh). You can’t even compare Ah ratings across batteries unless you know for a fact that they run the same voltage. Unless you’re discussing 5V portable phone chargers, Amp-hours is not a proper or useful measurement.


#41

I wasn’t going to comment here but this is getting out of hand

I’m sorry but I have to disagree with almost everything mentioned by @Joe_Nixon, not out of any spite for him/her or any blind allegiance to Eve but by the simple fact that I think it’s something of miracle that you guys are about to finally receive your V’s. the amount of stars that had to align for this to come to fruition rather than being another project on the crowd funding scrapheap, is probably in the dozens. Any one of which not aligning would have resulted in Eve folding.

So instead of complaining I’d ask you to count your blessings because posts like this which get so very personal (hire a new pm etc) are starting to really piss me off. You guys (all the backers) have put a certain amount of money into this. for some of you this will be alot of money (it would to me) and for others it won’t be all that much (probably not many people), so I totally understand being worried that your V’s might not get delivered and you’ve lost your money as so many others have on failed crowdfunding projects but that time has long scene come and gone (the issue with the screen supplier).

The team has been VERY open and honest about everything (too their own detriment no less). This is a catch 22 because they are damned if the do tell you everything that’s going wrong and damned if they don’t tell you everything that’s going wrong. This puts them in a very difficult position and I say kudos for keeping up morale and still continuing to update us as you receive the info. How many other CEO’s personal phone numbers does anyone have? The information the team posts is very close to the wire and thus can easily change, which inevitably makes Eve look bad through no fault of their own (sharp screen delivery delays are perfect example of this). Also every company has these set backs, even well established companies like Samsung and apple, the difference is they get to hide their setbacks, whereas Eve is all out in the open. They could just as easily shut down the community and move back to a standard product development model and not have to deal with semi-personal attacks. I think its very cool that I can write a post and know that at least 3 members if the team will read it by the end of the day if not more and that I can directly chat with the team whenever necessary. Instead of my voice being lost inside some virtual feedback echo chamber.

Also no one is more invested in this than the team, whilst you guys have backed the project…you have not invested every penny you have into this enterprise as have the founders, you have not bet your entire career on this company as have the employees, you have not worked for FREE for months as have the community managers, you have not risked your very health by over working yourself trying to deliver this project!

So to somehow suggest that this was somehow for the lack of trying or effort of the team is laughable, to somehow suggest that everything would have gone perfectly to plan if they had only done such and such is laughable (because unforeseeable complication are exactly that… Unforseeable, you can’t plan for them). To somehow blame the team for the failing of third parties is ridiculous because it wasn’t in the teams hands.

So as we are so close to the finish line (we have actually crossed it in my opinion) I’d kindly ask you and anyone else who has grievances to just let it be if it is something that’s already been discussed to death, because there is Nothing in the original post that hasn’t been said by the team themselves, that they haven’t already apologised for. Of course if you want to discuss something new that’s fine but I personally see no benefit in opening up old wounds.

In all honesty what more can you possibly expect a dozen or so people to do? This IS their first own device and they have im pretty sure literally put blood sweat and tears into this. You haven’t added anything meaningful to the discussion and are just demoralising the community and the team for no reason when everyone should be excited about getting their devices.

Will there be a time for a post mortem… Sure… Will it result in answers like oh if we just did thease one or things then we wouldn’t have any problems whatsoever… Hell no… `a good project manager’ will not in any way magically solve any of the problems you have listed… At all… Because a project manager can’t control something that’s out of his hands all they can do is work around it. I can say this because I’m sat next to our team project manager and work for a global ‘architecture’ firm with the tagline ‘the project delivery specialists’ a project manager is only as good as the information they are given. If the information they are given is poor then all they can do is make do with what they have, what they can control, which is PRECISELY what eve have been doing. The issue is so little of it is under Eves direct control and influence because of their small size and I think they should be commended for doing such an admirable job in getting large players to cooperate.

So I say it again, you should count your blessings and I for one would like to commend the team and most members of the community for rallying together to get this project past the finish line. And I would say that I love the ‘can do’ attitude of the team and the support of the community because that’s the ONLY thing that’s gotten us this far. "there is no education like adversity“ so no matter how good someones qualifications are they are only ever as good as what they have learnt from their failures and if they haven’t failed what do they really know?

I am very proud of what the team has achieved and likewise this community but as a lesson never forget that your biggest strength is also your biggest weakness and Eves strength is its community to everyone reading this DONT BE THAT Weakness, don’t create disunity because once it starts this whole thing will unravel.


#42

Very well said - thank you


#43

Thank you Attiq !
Can we archive this post for future use ?
Very good by helping people to open the other eye: 2 eyes gives perspective; one eye sees everything flat.


#44

I couldn’t agree more with you sentiments and thoughts. Well said!