Hire a proper PM with an industry recognised qualification


#1

@Team
This is addressed to the Eve Team and management

In a previous post I firmly laid the blame of the delays at the feet of the backers for it was us that voted for the original screen and I fully supported the efforts of the EVE team in this post.

However since a new screen manufacturer was chosen I can only say that the project management of this product since then has left a lot to be desired. First your critical paths were never identified and if they were it was far to late in the project. As adjustments were made to the supply chain there was absolutely no risk assessments done because if this had ever been done we would not be where we are today, delay after delay.

I can affirm this by simple calling out the promises that Sharp will move ASAP, earlier screen deliveries were alluded to. Then the blame was put on sharp for it credit check processes.

We were told that the frame would not have to be re-tooled and yet it did. This means the design team or person were unable to use the CAD package at their disposal and instantly know where the issues would be. 101 CAD

On the re-tooling a lot of the frames were damaged. The moment the first one was damaged you had a new critical path for EB’s. So why were additional frames not ordered then and there as “spare” batches instead of the wait and see approach.

This has all led to delays which could have been avoided or at the very least mitigated. So in effect it has taken 9 months to do a screen replacement, as they would say in the US “Come on guys, seriously, who do you think you are kidding” Thanks to the gods it was only that or we could be waiting another year.

I know this is a moot point, but seriously get a real PM, not someone who believes they are a PM. Someone with an internationally recognized qualification not some module while they were in university. And if you do have a PM with a proper certification then sack them because they are seriously lacking in the tool sets a PM is required to have in order to reliably do their job

This all started out with most of us accepting delays were inevitable due to the nature of the project. But what has happened over the last 5 months has been ridiculous because it could all have been avoided with some proper management and interventions. Having a positive outlook is only an advantage in your personal lives it is a hindrance in a commercial environment. A good risk management process which any PM worth their weight in salt, which is not a lot these days, would have instigated would have avoided most of the idiotic delays we as backers have had to endure since March and then June!

I say this because the project started out as being a late Xmas gift for 2016, to then being a late birthday gift to self during the summer of 2016 to now being a DEFINITE late Xmas gift for 2017. Please don’t spout any more BS about some of the EB’s may get their Eve’s before Xmas when this is patently not true. We only have to consider the delivery of the HEB’s supposedly this week but definitely next week.

Now in the latest update we find out that EB manufacturing has only started this week??? But guess what, the frame tooling issue will guarantee further delays.

This is not your first device, as a company you have brought a tablet to market before this project.

Now let’s talk about a very simple idea call “OPPORTUNITY COST”. This is a term that all of you should become familiar with.
Opportunity Cost: A benefit, profit, or value of something that must be given up to acquire or achieve something else.

For a lot of backers we made the decision to go with Eve because a lot of us were considering replacing our current devices. However as can been seen in the forums a lot of us have had to go to the market to buy other devices to tide us over, and we only did this after the summer delays.

To say I am disappointing with the further delays for EB’s is a f****** understatement

I thought long and hard about posting a negative post at such a late date. However I have to consider how reserved I have been up to this moment and I just said “F*** it” someone has to say it.

I can say this without reserve I won’t be backing any other project from the Eve team, I will let others suffer first and I will only consider a purchase when the device has been out there a while. I simple have no faith in the teams project management skills, non what so ever at this point in time. I did, but no longer.

In addition to this HEB’s got a measly 5% discount and the EB’s got zilch. Guys whether you believe this or not, we as the community were fed a diet of over optimistic expectations that everything would go “hunky dorey” for you when you cleared the next hurdle. The only problem is you forgot there are always continuing problems in every project and this is why a good PM is an absolute necessity.

If this was your first ever project as a company I could turn the other way and say learning curve. However it is not your first product and more importantly after June the learning curve was officially over, you as a company should have gotten your act together far earlier than you have.

Abysmal failures by any measurement, most especially the 2017 June to Dec period.

Happy seasons greetings to all here.

P.S. My policy is if you don’t call it out then change does not happen.


Shipment news and the promised update 15.12
LB Shipping Corner
#2

The seemingly endless amounts of complaints continue. I’m not just picking on this post (they are numerous). I believe the @team is aware of the shortcomings of this project, and have taken them to heart for future projects. Everything is a learning curve and opportunity to grow. At this point, all the complaints have been heard and, imo, we certainly don’t need new posts regarding project timelines and delivery as they are on the forum ad-nauseum.

I do realize the merit in the potential of having a project manager, which I believe could have been stated in a much more constructive way.


#3

While I’m not from Eve team I wanted to make a couple comments:

  1. This was the team’s first device made from scratch (the T1 was basically a chinese tablet with a wrapper).

  2. It’s obvious that the predictions were too optimistic but after doing this first project it will be easier to tell.

  3. I’d say you would need to more about the way the project because the problems might not be solely or even for the most part caused by bad project management (although the responsibility is always there).


#4

I’m not going to adress every point in your post since I just can’t, but I want to let a few things shine through: The T1 was basically an existing device on which the Eve branding was slapped and it was sold for cheap as you can read in the latest wired article ( https://www.wired.com/story/how-two-guys-and-an-internet-forum-built-a-kickass-computer/ ). So, the V is actually their very first device.

All in all, I share some of your concerns, but dislike the wording tbh. I’m not 100% certain and can’t be, but I for one am still believing that Eve managed the things better as laid out here, but of course I can’t say that everything wasn’t preventable since I just don’t know enough about the matter at hand.

And about the battery: I have no clue about batteries, but I’m actually interested in the answers to your questions since -well- I don’t know anything about this topic. I have to say though that we don’t know yet how much software changes can improve the battery life (especially regarding benchmarks - we should all know by now that major manufacturers tune their devices specifically to give good results for them)

Edit: Haha, I expected @fanoftech4life to write about the T1 stuff, when I was seeing him typing, but thought I’ll be faster… Damn you! :stuck_out_tongue:


#5

Just adding support for the OP, it would be really good to get some tests, real world or bench mark or otherwise that proves the original battery life assertions, it was a pretty large selling point and if I remember correctly one that was marketed as a directly competitive one?

Does the team know if there’s any plans for comparative testing?


#6

The one thing stated by @Joe_Nixon that I don’t think anyone can argue against is that “if you don’t call it out then change does not happen.”

Indeed, all the complaints have been heard (probably). But there is a reason why they are still being raised: the delivery (and the manufacturing of the second batch) is still being delayed and a lot of questions have been been answered properly. (I do appreciate some recent efforts by the team, but they are still not meeting certain standards held by many.)

But on the other hand, so do the “endless amounts of complaints continue” complaints continue, as you are complaining about the continuation of the other narrative. If you feel the other narrative is not so constructive, make it be. You can try to take such complains more positively, rather than criticizing those person who raise their genuine concerns; you can try to understand and respect your cohorts (if you are also one of the customers) or your customers (if you are from the team) – their different thoughts very likely have the same merit as yours; and you can try harder to hold the company better fulfill its promises, rather than pretending nothing negative happened. I believe no single side should be blamed for polarization: it always takes two sides to create such a situation. Blaming someone is probably the worst way to gap the bridge.


#7

I just want to say: I agree with your post. While the language you, at times, choose could be changed to make it feel a bit less inflammatory, you are right that things cannot keep going like this. I’m sure that there will be an official response from the team, but I’ve been in this community long enough to know that whatever we can do better, we will do better. Remember, nobody wins if EVE looks bad, least of all the team, and so I am certain that they are constantly working on adapting all the steps in the process to make the manufacture quicker and more seamless. I do also think, though this is personal, that a company like EVE should be granted some leeway here, since starting mass production on a product like this is never easy, and I’m sure that they themselves wish that they could have identified some of the problems earlier, but hey, hindsight is always 20/20.


#8

It’s not just hindsight though. I think its even happening now, where the Eve’s are shipping. While European HEB seem to get their notifications about delivery, US HEB have not heard anything nothing from the EVE team. A customer journey starts from the beginning to when the customer has a product in hand, even beyond but again radio silence!

All these things @Joe_Nixon mentioned are valid points, and the excuse of “its their first product”, does not count, it’s PM 101. Also, reading the Wired article, Eve seems to have Mentor’s from the industry, so the I didn’t know excuse, I think, does not count.

Growing as a company is hard, but to know when to ask for help and to know when you need to add resources, to handle more things is important!


#9

Always easy to generalise things and make it sound easy. Some valid points but way too rant to take everything seriously.

Nobody is saying they haven’t learned anything, it’s a.process which takes time.

Also these “mentors” will not walk you holding your hand, they give general advices and it’s your job to make it happen.


#10

I think this is a really important point. I was neither a HEB, nor an EB, and as such had no personal financial investment in the project, but one thing that has bothered me since the day I joined the community is what I would consider to be mostly-blind optimism despite setback after setback.

On one hand, I realize that getting angry about the failures of this project is useless – there’s literally nothing we can do to fix past failures, and our anger is not going to make our Vs arrive any sooner. On the other hand, however, what does blind optimism accomplish? What does giving Eve the benefit of the doubt over and over do? I would venture to say that it makes all of us feel good inside, but that it does nothing in the way of encouraging future improvement. In my opinion, Eve DOES have to answer to the community for their failures, especially the HEBs/EBs. They took a lot of people’s money in the IGG campaign and have failed to deliver time and time again.

Now, here comes the part where someone says something to the effect of “It was explicitly stated that supporting the IGG campaign had inherent risk and that there was no guarantee of ever receiving a device” – this is absolutely true, but it’s also not a reason to discredit and disregard angry community members. We have a right to be angry, and from my perspective at least, so many of the angry comments and threads have gotten shut down with what amounts to the authors being told to stop being negative, which to me, doesn’t accomplish anything and only fosters resentment.

For me, this post, although a bit inflammatory to some (I personally thought the tone of the OP was appropriate), was one of the more constructive threads. It wasn’t negative for negativity’s sake; it actually asks some important questions and presents some reasonable plans for improvement in the future. It asks for responsibility to be taken for some of the more egregious failures, specifically the lackluster battery life which, to my knowledge, still has not been addressed by Konsta and/or the team.

Anyway, I don’t mean to perpetuate negativity beyond what’s necessary; I just want posts like this to be taken seriously.


#11

Many of you make valid points and I think the questions @Joe_Nixon is asking the team are fair. Let’s give Eve a little time to respond now, as they are very busy with sales/logistics at the moment. A hundred people commenting saying ‘cmon @team, answer the question’ won’t help, it’ll just make this thread a pain to read. Give them a little time and let them respond to these valid questions.


#12

Based on an earlier post by a team member (I forgot which…), the “@team” function is actually not working (at least anymore). But you make a good point.


#13

Ok, but since the Vs have left the HK distribution centre, shipping and distribution are out of EVEs hand, and if the shipping company is slow, there is literally nothing EVE can do to remedy that, besides not use them in the future.

p.s. the @team function still works, at least for me


#14

@ Team works. It’s only that most of the team visit the community so rarely that they end up with hundreds of notifications, which makes it hard for them to get through them all and find the relevant ones.


#15

You chose to back the product on your own, you should have considered all possible risks before you invested money. I find it silly for community members and backer alike to hold EVE, a tech-startup company, to the same standards as established tech giants like Microsoft. They have a small team and limited funds, they are also inexperienced in the industry. Although I do agree with some of your points with regards to releasing testing information and battery data but other than that I found your post to be quite unfair to say the least. I’m sure @Team is doing their best and taking in as much constructive criticism as they can, let them grow more as a company and I’m sure they will not disappoint.


#16

People do have a bad habit of saying @ team when they don’t need to. If only there was some kind of notification whenever somebody used that, that possibly blocked the reply button, and won’t allow you to post unless you verify that you do in fact want to get the team’s attention. The current notification doesn’t need to work exactly as desired…


#17

I don’t think the notification is the problem, I think those people want to complain (not describing everyone who has a complaint, just certain people) and they think that trolling @ team is the most effective way to do it.


#18

Yeah: a long list of missed deadlines.

But: telling that this comes from an integrity problem (see many posts /authors) is rather close to alt/logic stuff.

An inexperienced team makes inexperience choices.
An zero integrity team makes zero integrity choices.
The visible results can be very similar.

When the team went to China, photo’s showed they traveled economy class. Imagine, the CEO plus his close team circle in economy class. That was for a lot of hours. No throwing money around when your position could claim business class, for me this was a proof of integrity.

Give them the time to learn from what ran out of control.
They will become quite good and will be staying trustful.
Do we want more ?


#19

That’s certainly a problem, but there isn’t really a good way to prevent that.

If you look through even just this thread, you can see a few examples of people simply mentioning the team and tagging them, and that just shouldn’t happen at all. If tagging @ team was an inconvenience, a lot less people would [probably] do it.


#20

Don’t have any experience managing production so I can’t properly judge which delays should’ve been avoided.

I have to agree on the communication sometimes feeling quite misleading at least to me, too. Just as one example, I remember emailing the team about possibly switching my shipping address to Argentina for my trip down there in Oct. Response was very positive and stating it shouldn’t be an issue. Given the later revealed issues on time frame it did seem cynical to even engage me on the idea of switching the address, team must’ve known by then that a October delivery was unrealistic.

Now, to the more relevant. Even if it would be too late now anyway - I definitely second wanting to have solid info on battery life. At the point I went in on this it was pictured as A if not THE priority for the project. Every group interaction in this forum further established that focus.

If Eve falls short on real life battery life it’s a goner for me.