Eve V vs. Competition!


#455

We have a KBL-R device here at the office. And I can tell you that power consumption when using it is at least 2.5 times higher))

Can’t say more that device is under NDA:)


#456

I5 variant actually has 256gb ssd. Double the storage means alot for the same price.


#457

I looked at the switch 7 a bit, and while it is mildly tempting… I’ve got some issues with it:

  • Kickstand looks kind of flimsy, I’m afraid I’m going to break it
  • Unsure about battery life
  • ports are a bit lacking
  • While the processor is beefier, I have a dedicated rig at home to do all the heavy lifting. Besides, I’d also want to use my home desktop for the bigger screen anyway. Trying to program or do 3D work on a tiny screen really isn’t appealing to me.

That being said, it still is a fantasy of mine to be able to pick up a tablet and at least do some sculpting in Zbrush. Switch would be a bit closer to that, but the tradeoffs aren’t worth it in my opinion.


#458

I don’t agree with that. Apple has had its fair share of flaw materials come out, including the screen problem on the 2013 Macbook Pro. I know tech repair guys who shake their head at Apple’s so called flawless build quality and how badly they screw customers. My older brother who I live with is one of them. Apple’s ecosystem>>>anything else Apple has to offer.

But I’m Windows until the end. I really don’t like iOS at all.


#459

Notebookcheck did what I have been waiting for those who have KBL-R samples to do and ran Cinebench for 30 min like they do with all devices. I did see the peaks and declines in the multi core performance, but KBL-R is no different from how some Skylake H processors acted and how some current Kaby Lake H series processors act. (Single core performance was stable). As a consumer, that shows me that I’d be better off getting a Skylake H or Kaby Lake H device at a discounted rate. Ideally, ALL laptops using KBL-R need to allow the TDP limit to go to 25W. Only Lenovo’s T470 implemented and executed this correctly thus far. But it was cooled well and built well. X1 Carbon and X1 Yoga were not b/c of their emphasis on thinness.

This is going to come down to how properly cooled the device is. And some OEMS could not get it right with dual core processors.


#460

Oh and if I was going to get the Switch 7, I’m adding some sort of additional external cooling. I don’t trust liquid loop and I don’t mind the sound of fans.


#461

As I understood, the system Acer first invented for their Aspire Switch 12S used circulating fluid, not just fluid in a ring. They have a proprietary method of causing circulatory motion without a motorized pump. This makes it an actual liquid circuit like a radiator instead of just liquid-filled conductors (heat pipe).


#462

I am not sure now if you incorrectly interpret how a heat pipe is working due your statement of a liquid filled conductor, you may more elaborate on that. But the fluid travels back in the pipe to the heat source after changing state and radiating heat, what acer has, uses same thermodynamic principles to absorb heat and radiate somewhere else. In a heat pipe usually the fluid travels back on the inner surface of the pipe due the capillary effect, Acer uses this probably too but the fluid travels forwards in a loop to the heat source again, it is a self sustaining system in both cases. I guess that the first 50% of Acers ring inner surface is not containing the micro capillary structure, the fluid travels there as a gas, then it condenses and travels forward through the rest of the loop that has the inner surface to allow the medium travel as fluid.
Thats probably all to it, i really would not see any miracles there…


#463

I will elaborate: The “Liquid Loop” that Acer uses is physically and thermodynamically a loop instead of a bi-directional multiphase flow in a single separated-channel pipe. A regular heat pipe, once it reaches equilibrium with the heat source and sink, is relying solely on the enthalpy of vaporization for energy transference. This is due to the shared medium (albeit separated) in the pipe that keeps the fluid very close to the transition point in both directions of flow.

Although it is difficult to find specifics on how Acer’s LiquidLoop improves upon this, I believe the main difference is in the loop structure that continues to radiate heat in liquid form after the enthalpy of condensation has been expended. This means that fluid returning to the heat sink is of a lower temperature than it would be if it returned through a conventional heat pipe. Technologically this is not a huge difference, and may not even provide as significant an improvement as advertised, but it is enough of a difference that they have used the system in multiple models and the heat dissipation is enough such that it makes the surface of the device uncomfortable to touch. I would say based on the surface temperature response alone, it is more effective than traditional heat pipes.


#464

I hope someone would tinker with one of the loops and at least on an enthusiast level measure what that thing is capable of. The loop is longer, which may cause it to be more effective. Purely speculating that a traditional pipes effectiveness may be lower due the 2 states of the medium interacting and part of the gas condensing already on its way, separating the 2 states in a loop would be an innovative approach.
My point though was that this thing is far from what the usual customer understands under liquid cooling and that this is exactly a liquid cooling solution as the traditional heat-pipe is. The benefits of calling it liquid cooling and attract customers through the wow effect may be much higher than the supposedly higher effectiveness achieved, and i think i stated it already that i would not be surprised if one of the main factors why they designed it would be to claim a patent and call it a liquid cooling loop :stuck_out_tongue:
Dont take me wrong, im not trying to play it down before seeing some numbers, i am just put off by the marketing side of it and that alot of folks do react in hype just because it states: has ‘liquid cooling’, but at the same time their laptop, their GPU, probably their CPU cooler and too maybe their cell phone is liquid cooled the same…


#465

Oh, well yes. It was definitely developed to set Acer apart from the competition. Whether that is in performance, appearance, or a mixture of the two is debatable. I still don’t think it is exactly the same as heat-pipe cooling though, purely because the loop allows the fluid to cool down past the transition temperature. Once a heat pipe is running in full, the coldest the return fluid can get is the vaporization temperature. This allows faster circulation, but less potential energy flow. In a “liquid cooled” system the coldest the return fluid can get is the ambient temperature of the environment. If Acer’s system can manage to do that while still pushing the same flow rates, then their heat dissipation will be better purely because it continues to cool while in a liquid state (“liquid cooled”). A heat-pipe is more aptly stated as “gas cooled” or “transition cooled”. The liquid cooling that Acer has implemented is more of a hybrid liquid-gas cooling since heat is radiated in both states, but by calling it “Liquid Cooled” it cements in the average consumer’s mind as the large-scale liquid cooling systems in desktop PCs. I don’t think it is nearly as strong as the high-volume system that the marketing implies, but I still believe it has more value over heat pipes than just marketing.

Reducing power usage in the CPU is a better improvement than just shoving more power to the surface of a device, but I can’t fault Acer for doing their best with what Intel provides them.


#466

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xNMR26o-YE&feature=youtu.be

Ugh, Chuwi, so close dammit. Can’t argue with $400-ish bones, but the battery life is a major bummer after the “all day and then some” Chuwi Hi12. Hopefully that’s something that can be improved with subsequent tweaks/revisions. Still, I’m very curious to see the Surbook 2 (?), especially since they’ve put out a call for suggestions as to the specs (m3 seems to be #1 with a bullet). Gotta be honest, if they can tighten up some of the design quibbles and give it a decent processor (without a major price hike), that’s a pretty compelling low-end alternative.


#467

Very competetive price for Microsoft Surface Pro 4 - M for 595,59€.
Hope to see the regular webshop price of V soon and with an up to date market price.

Link: https://www.mydealz.de/visit/thread/1048990

Sorry its in German:
CPU: Intel Core m3-6Y30, 2x 900MHz mit Turbo bis 2.20 GHz
• RAM: 4GB DDR3L
• Festplatte: 128GB SSD
• Grafik: Intel HD Graphics 515 (IGP), Mini DisplayPort
• Display: 12.3", 2736x1824, Multi-Touch, Digitizer
• Anschlüsse: 1x USB-A 3.0
• Wireless: WLAN 802.11a/b/g/n/ac, Bluetooth 4.0
• Navigation: Kompass
• Cardreader: microSDXC
• Webcam: 5.0 Megapixel (vorne), 8.0 Megapixel (hinten)
• Betriebssystem: Windows 10 Pro 64bit
• Akku: Li-Ionen, 9h Laufzeit
• Abmessungen: 292.1x201.4x8.4mm
• Gewicht:766g
• Besonderheiten: Lichtsensor, Beschleunigungssensor, Gyroskop, Dockinganschluss (SurfaceConnect), TPM 2.0
• Herstellergarantie: zwei Jahre


#468

I’m very interested into portable devices in this price range. I admit that at less then 600 Euros, even the Surface Pro 4 would start to be intriguing… However, I see 2 major flaws in the offer:

  • Keyboard is still NOT included (+127 Euro to have MS “basic” keyboard!!)
  • 4GB RAM quite bothers me, especially considering the increased price for 8GB RAM would not be huge on MS (i.e. they are dwarfing the RAM specifically to make you buy the i5 version 8GB 256GB SSD for a hefty premium…)

Also, Eve V will have a newer processor (7th generation vs 6th generation on SP4), better audio, more ports.
Pluses for the SP4 vs Eve-V: better front/back cameras, Windows 10 Pro included (you can have it on the V as a $50 upgrade).

All considered, this leads me to the conclusion that the IGG HEB and EB prices on the m3 versions are still competitive (read: blasting) with the sale offers for SP4, even one year later! I’m eagerly waiting for mine :slight_smile:

I hope the regular store price will be competitive as you do, however the fair comparison is with this: (still without included type-cover and 4GB RAM :roll_eyes:)


#469

That thing is still 770 with keyboard…


#470

Howzit, has anyone considered this device: Ockel Sirius A Prohttps://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ockel-sirius-a-the-world-s-most-versatile-mini-pc-mobile-design–2#/ ?


#471

Huawei Matebook E i5 have the similar specification as Eve V i5 variant but cost as much as m3 variant @US$799.98 now even after black friday sales.

Other than on tablet difference, they come with a dock on keyboard without bluetooth function and does not comes with stylus.

But considering the price to performance, wouldnt the Huawei Matebook E stands out?


#472

It does seem like a bargain! Compared to the V it has: only one usb c, not as good of a screen, no kickstand so less angles, a much smaller battery and it’s not as well cooled. I mean if that’s ok for your use case, it’s definitely a good price/value ratio.


#473

Intel Atom is known fo anemic performances, but the whole concept is rather brilliant.


#474

The V was just recommended as a Surface Pro alternative but its highlighted as a product starting from $800 plus. What is the Eve team’s response to the pricing?