[Donald Dock][Step 2.2] [SUMMARY/DISCUSSION] Potential product type

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#1

*** This post is part of the Donald Dock project development.
*** Please check the master thread for whole project information

Purpose: summarize users’ needs, propose potential product type and discuss, and prepare for voting
Duration: 23.10.2017 – 30.10.2017

Dear community,

Sorry that this post come a bit late than expected.
It took us some time to review all your needs and communicate with potential ODM.

What you are going to read:

  1. Summary of users’ need in step 2.1
  2. Product types proposed by Eve team

What we expect from YOU in the discussion:

  1. Share your opinion about the proposed product types
  2. Suggest possible improvements/adjustments, or new product type.

What is going to happen afterwards:

  1. Based on your discussion, Eve team update the potential product types
  2. Vote to determine the product type(s) for Donald Dock

Summary of the needs

What we did was to read all your replies (before 12.10), record needs to a table, categorize them, and quantify them: if you said I want X, X get 2 points; if you said I may need X, X get 1 point

Result:

What environment you are going to use Donald Dock at?

Environment

Detailed needs for display

Detailed needs for audio

Detailed needs for storage

Other needs

Especially for eGPU

Egpu

In addition, the following features are mostly commented:

  • Dual monitor or even more (22 times)
  • Just one plug-in for all peripherals and power supply (13 times)
  • Modular/Daisy chain (10 times)
  • Future proofing (7 times)
  • Notebook can be slid into Donald Dock, or hold by it (5 times)

How Eve understands above data:

  1. Majority of people would like to use Donald Dock at stationary scenario (home/office), however still more than 20% want to take it on-the-go
  2. Display, audio, and storage are the main peripherals categories to connect with. Keyboard, mouse, Ethernet are also very popular.
  3. eGPU has its potential users
  4. Some users need different types of Donald Dock at different environment
  5. more understanding can be found in the following proposed product types

Proposed Product types

After digested all the needs you shared, and did some Google research, as well as consulted the manufacture, here are the five product types we think will fulfill your needs

Please note:

  • Product sketches below are just to show a GENERAL idea about the product size. It’s not related to the final industrial design
  • Feature list below is also to show the GENERAL idea about potential features of different product types. ‘Possible’ doesn’t mean have it for sure, we have to select; ‘Nope’ mainly means impossible on business & design point of view, technically, some features are still possible.
  • We are ONLY discussing product types here. After selecting product type, technical details of the product will be discussed and determined in the future design phase.

*Why it looks so awesome :heart_eyes: ? Because it is made by Dario! :rofl:

There already some good discussions in the Development Donald Dock | Community Ideas & discussion, like Revised proposal for modular dock with GPU.

So, welcome to summaries your ideas here, share your opinion about the proposed product types, and suggest possible improvements/adjustments, or new product type.


Modular dock idea
[Donald Dock][Step 3.1][SUMMARY/POLL] Decide product type
[Donald Dock][Step 2.1][DISCUSSION] What you need and how you will use it
[Donald Dock] [Step 4.3] [POLL] Decide product specs & features
#2

Could we just enjoy for a second those summary graphs… like… 10/10


#3

Great writeup @Xinjie - I like Middleweight 2 - would potentially fit all my needs and i like the idea arounding holing at the right angle - obviously 1 works just as well feature wise.

Are you thinking about producing all 5? Or looking to narrow the focus down? For me the intersting differential will be cost to purchase between middle and super weight - I think that will be the thing that influences take up.


#4

Hard to choose but I would propably go with the Middleweight 1 or 2. And maybe the light weight/feather weight for travels


#5

First of all: THIS. IS. AMAZING. I knew that you @Xinjie and Dario can make great work but this is on a whole new level.

Now, onwards to my opinion

I have one core improvement for all versions of Donals:

  • Power Delivery: What I think people meant was that it should just be simple to charge your device via Donald - which can be easily achieved through USB-PD forwarding of the USB-C port. Meaning: You plug in Donald into your V and your USB-C charging cable into Donald - thus charging the V.
    What I (personally) don’t think is needed is a integrated PSU with power delivery in Donald - if it’s supporting USB-C power delivery, then it’s not needed even in the middle & superpower Donalds.

Now, what I think about the size/form factor: As a majority of people want to use Donald at home or on the go, I think a good middle ground is something between the light and middle 1 Donald - providing portability for the agile people that fly around the globe and connectivity for the work horses that need 15 USB-A ports for all peripherals.

Since that seems to be the main focus of Donald, I want to talk about the features possible within those 2 ‘weight classes’. I won’t touch on the core features, those are locked in my opinion :wink: :

  • Battery (possible): A USP if Donald is used on the go - personally I find my battery lasting throughout the day with my phone/hopefully my V. When I don’t make it, it’s usually a clutch moment where even a small extra battery can save my day. A small battery (read: 2000 mAh or similar size) would be a welcome addition for to-go-use.
    Downside: No advantage for the home-users, as it’d increase the price of Donald.

  • Power Delivery (must-have): Touched upon in my core improvement suggestion. Basically if we have USB-PD passthrough we would not need an integrated PSU in Donald.
    Downside: Possibly for home-users as you’d have to buy a extra PSU for Donald if you want one on the go as well. However it’d make Donald cheaper and accomodate that downside.

  • Dual Monitor (possible): Since we have HDMI & VGA & DisplayPort on Donald in all variations I see no good reason to not allow to connect multiple monitors. Why don’t have it in the feather-class already? :smiley:
    Downside: I will spend more money on monitors :stuck_out_tongue:

  • Built-In-Storage/M.2 Slot (possible): A very neat feature that allows to easily expand storage. I’d NOT go with built-in storage but stick with an M.2 slot to allow it to be easily customized by the user of Donald.
    Downside: I think this is something more ‘On-the-go’ users of Donald would appreciate. Usually at home there is some other option to expand the storage of V - be it a NAS or an external HDD that is connected to Donald by default.Thus I think it’s not as important for home users as for mobile ones.

  • Daisy Chain TB3 (possible): Why not? Simple as that. I don’t see a use-case for me personally but it’s for sure something that can be used for futureproofing Donald.
    Downside: Cost. Potentially not as useful for mobile users as you’d want to daisy-chain a second device which you’d have to carry with you.

  • Switches (possible but useless?): Ok, this is the one thing that I don’t think would make much sense - switches to allow you to switch between different monitors/power on/off a Port. My reasoning is simple:
    Switching monitors is something you can already do in Software without problems (be it Windows, OSX or Linux) and so I won’t even touch on that.
    USB-power makes more sense, but it’s a very niche application which I personally did not have any use for yet - if I did not want something I could just plug it out since it requires roughly as much time as hitting the switch to turn the USB-power off.
    Downside: Personal opinion here but I can’t see a good use-case for the Switches. But that’s my 2 cents on it. :slight_smile:

So, that’s my 2 cents on it :slight_smile:


#6

I second @inffy with Middleweight 1 or 2 but would like option 2 much more.

By reading the list described by @Xinjie I thought that we most likely described the status quo in our wish list but did not go for (maybe) better ideas on connectors such as Bluetooth.


#7

Thanks a lot for such summary.
One question though, why is the RJ45 need in the Audio category?


#8

Now that I think about it more after Peters list :slight_smile:

I would go for the lightweigt if it would just have the USB-PD pass through so just for charging through Donald and the support for multiple monitors.


#9

Why do you keep mentioning notebooks in this thread?


#10

Reading the list I would vote for lightweight, for a cost effective on-the-go station, or the superpower weight si to have V transformed in a powerful desktop solution when at home :slight_smile:


#11

And is it just me or does the middle weight category offer no real benefits over lightweight?


#12

Lightweight becoz of mobility!
And I prefer a LegoDock to Donal/Daisy Dock if someone puts some great idea on it.
My Eve will spend more time on travel than sitting anywhere else.


#13

Personally I think the feather weight and the superpower weight will be most useful to me.

If I’m bringing a hub with me on the go I will want it to be as lightweight and small as possible because the only features I really need would be HDMI connection and the SD card reader, but if the hub got too big I might as well just bring a USB-C to HDMI cable and a separate USB card reader instead.

At home, though, the option to use an eGPU would be very welcomed. I have always considered buying the Aorus GTX 1070 gaming box to accompany my V (when the web shop eventually opens and I get to buy one). But if there’s a EVE branded eGPU I will definitely buy that instead.


#14

I’m with @Kuri64. Lightweight, but with two holes (distance 14,3cm diagonally) for the Donald VEGA mounters or attaching a ribbon for the Donald travellers… And superpower weight one for making the V a beast!!! (time and money are influencing each other… If the superpower Donald needs more time I can save more money for that)


#15

@Xinjie and Dario - you really did an awesome job for this well structured and
graphically appealing thread. Thanks.

For me personally i’d love an feather weight on-the-go dock for travelling, and the middle weight design for the use at home.

As for the superpower weight dock for an eGPU box design, I’d love to see the dock and eGPU separated, so you can decide afterwards if you want to upgrade your dock with an eGPU box. That would be pretty cool.

That being said, i think daisy chain is a good way to go and Power Delivery is also useful to implement. As for a battery pack - couldn’t you connect your powerbank via USB-A/C with the dock if you are really in additional battery need?


#16

um… just thinkin, how about if we can put an egpu slot ? but the gpu itself is no need to be inside the case?.. so we still get the nice portability, but also got an egpu slot.
so, when someone need more power for gpu, they can put the gpu in outer case, but the slot itself still part of the dock…
anyone know what i mean?

aagh… its hard to explain…, sorry… i’ll try to sketch it tonight if i can :frowning:


#17

Nice summery.

But why do we still need VGA (D-SUB). It’s an old dying standard, Please get rid of it. Use DP, HDMI or DVI.

The V has an Built-in Kickstand why do we need the middle weight 2 option?


#18

@inffy: I am still not convinced. The lightweight variant is nothing for the desk but as shown most need it for the desk - such as me.
The addition of middleweight 2 in order to have the V as an opportunity for a proper placable (second or third) monitor is a great benefit.
Either a hybrid (Peters’ suggestion) of light- to middleweight gets a real benefit or it only blurs its purpose and nobody has a benefit. I am really sceptical about such a hybrid when reading Peters’ arguments. I think it should go along the lines of do it right and not searching for compromises - I see the other side as it would be a great achievement if the Team or members of the community get a very well thought through hybrid. Maybe we should strive for this but as said, I am sceptical and would see the home/at work dock solution at risk. Maybe I am too conventional to think: Make Donald dock a middle weight 2 variant that really sits on the desk and make Daisy dock as a light-/middleweight portable.


#19

For me: It would be a proper solution to place it as a second or third monitor in proper height besides the other monitors. At least the screens of my other monitors are not on the desk but at least 15 cm above. So if this helps to get the Vs’ screen in line with the other monitors it would be good.


#20

Or even better, make these modular, so that the travel dock clicks into the middle weight solution.
To be sold separately, of course.